Last modified: 2012-09-10 08:37:10 UTC
I think "merged" (to another bug report) describes better what it means; it's the terminology used by Google Code (which IMHO is generally horrible but sometimes has a point). Extremely low priority proposal, almost surely upstream and/or WONTFIX, which I file just to track the following circular discussion we had on #wikimedia-tech and which it would help to avoid in the future. ;-) 2012-09-05 2.42 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: exercises in logic clashes? https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=36096#c3 2012-09-05 2.43 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: What? 2012-09-05 2.43 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: Why did you re-open that bug? 2012-09-05 2.44 < Brooke> We dupe down unless there's a really good reason to dupe up. In this case, you duped up from a bug with a lot of explanation to a bug with a single sentence. 2012-09-05 2.45 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: you didn't explain this supposed convention 2012-09-05 2.45 < Brooke> Which part is confusing? 2012-09-05 2.45 < Nemo_bis> I keep the most useful bug open, surely not the most confusing one 2012-09-05 2.46 < Brooke> It's about courtesy to the bug filer. 2012-09-05 2.46 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: none, perhaps the part which was missing 2012-09-05 2.46 < Brooke> Saying "oh, your bug is a duplicate" when it was filed months or years earlier isn't very polite. 2012-09-05 2.46 < Nemo_bis> I don't see how. 2012-09-05 2.46 < Nemo_bis> When someone closes my bug as a duplicate my reaction is "oh, nice, someone else has noticed my bug elsewhere!" 2012-09-05 2.47 < Nemo_bis> "Oh, he even described it better!" 2012-09-05 2.47 < Nemo_bis> "Hey, this summary is wonderful" 2012-09-05 2.47 < Nemo_bis> etc. etc. 2012-09-05 2.47 < Brooke> If you really liked Niklas's description better, you can copy and paste to the old bug. 2012-09-05 2.48 < Brooke> And if there are indepedent problems with the original bug, they can be fixed. 2012-09-05 2.48 < Nemo_bis> no 2012-09-05 2.48 < Nemo_bis> uh? 2012-09-05 2.49 < Brooke> Duplicate usually means "you filed a bug that has already been filed." Duping up doesn't make much sense. 2012-09-05 2.49 < Nemo_bis> I disgree with your definition 2012-09-05 2.49 < Nemo_bis> {{citation needed}} 2012-09-05 2.49 < Brooke> It's only ever done when it's too onerous to copy the comments from the newer bug. 2012-09-05 2.50 < Nemo_bis> {{citation needed}} 2012-09-05 2.50 < Brooke> > The problem is a duplicate of an existing bug. 2012-09-05 2.50 < Brooke> That's what our docs say. 2012-09-05 2.50 < Nemo_bis> Yes and it's different from what you said 2012-09-05 2.51 < Nemo_bis> anyway part of my confusion was cause by the ignorance of the verbs "dupe up" and "dupe down", I admit 2012-09-05 2.52 < Nemo_bis> I've never had much luck with English phrasal verbs 2012-09-05 2.52 < Brooke> It's also kind of made-up English. ;-) 2012-09-05 2.52 < Nemo_bis> indeed 2012-09-05 2.52 < Brooke> I think there's a judgment being made on the bug filer when we resolve their bug. 2012-09-05 2.52 < Brooke> In the case of duplicates, I think it's unfair to say "well, you made a copy of a bug that came after yours." 2012-09-05 2.53 < Nemo_bis> marking as duplicate is just moving the bug, not trashing it 2012-09-05 2.53 < Brooke> It's distorted. 2012-09-05 2.53 < Nemo_bis> it's NOT what it says 2012-09-05 2.53 < Nemo_bis> don't repeat it 2012-09-05 2.53 < Brooke> You mean don't make a copy of it? 2012-09-05 2.53 < Nemo_bis> «say "well, you made a copy of a bug that came after yours."» 2012-09-05 2.53 < Nemo_bis> ok, as I sais, this is a logic problem 2012-09-05 2.53 < Brooke> That is what it's saying. 2012-09-05 2.54 < Brooke> You're labeling the old bug as a duplicate (a copy) of a future bug. 2012-09-05 2.54 < Nemo_bis> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equivalence_relation 2012-09-05 2.54 < Nemo_bis> you're messing up with tense 2012-09-05 2.54 < Brooke> spagewmf: Global renames are pretty painful. 2012-09-05 2.54 < Nemo_bis> lead section is horrible; better https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equivalence_relation#Definition 2012-09-05 2.55 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: Are you saying a duplicate is not a copy? 2012-09-05 2.55 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: I've no idea how the two terms differ 2012-09-05 2.56 < Brooke> Hmmm. 2012-09-05 2.56 < Brooke> I think I see what you're saying. 2012-09-05 2.56 < Nemo_bis> light came 2012-09-05 2.56 < Nemo_bis> :p 2012-09-05 2.56 < Brooke> But even with a copy, you still have the original. 2012-09-05 2.56 < Brooke> There's always the one that came first. It's timestamped, even. 2012-09-05 2.57 < Nemo_bis> I see duplicates just as another way to mark templates. 2012-09-05 2.57 < Brooke> templates? 2012-09-05 2.57 < Nemo_bis> It's different from blocker vs. blocked 2012-09-05 2.57 < Nemo_bis> bugs, sorry 2012-09-05 2.57 < Nemo_bis> It's different from blocker vs. blocked only in that it doesn't have nice graphs, but that's a bugzilla issue 2012-09-05 2.57 < Brooke> Right, but there's something to be said about the sequential nature of the bugs. 2012-09-05 2.57 < Nemo_bis> naaaaaaaaaaaaaah 2012-09-05 2.57 < Brooke> They're chronologically sequential. 2012-09-05 2.58 < Brooke> So to say "39000 is a dupe of 2400" is just wrong. :-/ 2012-09-05 2.58 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: doesn't make any sense 2012-09-05 2.58 < Brooke> What doesn't? 2012-09-05 2.58 < Brooke> That view? 2012-09-05 2.58 < Nemo_bis> "The problem is a duplicate of an existing bug." != "The problem was a duplicate of a bug existing before its creation" 2012-09-05 2.59 < Brooke> That it doesn't make sense is what I've been saying. ;-) 2012-09-05 2.59 < Nemo_bis> aka you're adding unstated assumptions somewhere 2012-09-05 2.59 < Brooke> They're not unstated. The bugs are chronologically sequential. 2012-09-05 2.59 < Brooke> They're ordered. 2012-09-05 2.59 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: the correct definition is the first, you're trying to impose the second 2012-09-05 2.59 < Brooke> You're viewing them as unordered. 2012-09-05 3.00 < Brooke> Which doesn't make much sense, because they're ordered. And timestamped. 2012-09-05 3.00 < Nemo_bis> ordering doesn't mean that the first has some entitlemenet 2012-09-05 3.00 < Brooke> It does when you're determining which to keep open. 2012-09-05 3.00 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: tautology 2012-09-05 3.00 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-come,_first-served 2012-09-05 3.01 < Brooke> It's a fairly old principle... 2012-09-05 3.03 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: which is not stated anywhere in our bugzilla; besides, a dupe is not unserved, the issue it is about is just moved elsewhere 2012-09-05 3.04 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: I kind of always assumed that everyone else looked at the numbering and felt similarly. 2012-09-05 3.04 < Brooke> But, sure, it could/should be better documented. 2012-09-05 3.09 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: actually, when someone closes my bug as duplicate I receive an email which says I've been kindly added to the cc of the other bug. I've always taken that as a kind redirect, a pointer, a "let's continue here". 2012-09-05 3.10 < Brooke> Nemo_bis: I personaly don't like having my bugs marked as duplicates. 2012-09-05 3.10 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: why 2012-09-05 3.10 < Brooke> It usually means to me that I was stupid and couldn't find the original bug. 2012-09-05 3.10 < Brooke> Or the original bug was vauge. 2012-09-05 3.10 < Brooke> vague 2012-09-05 3.10 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: it doesn't if the other bug has been filed afterwards 2012-09-05 3.11 < Nemo_bis> so this case doesn't make anyone feel stupid 2012-09-05 3.11 < Brooke> It can also make me as a bug filer feel ignored. 2012-09-05 3.11 < Brooke> I dunno. 2012-09-05 3.11 < Brooke> I view it as a principle of fairness. 2012-09-05 3.11 < Nemo_bis> I too feel stupid in the other case, but I think "oh well, I've added some sort of redirect for people searching my definition of this bug" 2012-09-05 3.12 < Brooke> Except resolved bugs rarely show up in searches. ;-) 2012-09-05 3.12 < Nemo_bis> Brooke: duplicates are shown by default 2012-09-05 3.12 < Brooke> Fair enough. 2012-09-05 3.12 < Nemo_bis> which is another reason why bugzilla surely doesn't treat them as trash as you seem to say 2012-09-05 3.13 < Nemo_bis> maybe we should call it RESOLVED #REDIRECT 2012-09-05 3.14 < Nemo_bis> and a bug like that receiving any sort of change after years is a relief for the reporter (at least when I'm the reporter), whatever the change
Could I be curious and ask the point to submit this proposal, then close it as RESO WONTFIX? You wanted to log you offered this idea and immediately rejected it?
(In reply to comment #1) > You wanted to log you offered this idea and immediately rejected it? This is a proposal to address a problem which I feel extremely minor, I don't want to clutter bugzilla. Anyone can easily reopen it if some value is found in it.